neurotic Iraqi wife
September 07, 2008
The blatant Neurotic Iraqi Truth…
Let me tell you about some of the things I learnt while being here for the past 3 years. (Warning, this may end up a long post). When I first came here, I would pass by people’s desks and see posters with the question “What have you done for the Iraqi people today?” This piece of paper was hung on almost everyone’s desks. I would laugh to myself and think what BS. Who are they kidding?
Come today and I myself can answer that question. They have done A LOT. I have been a long time critic of the US and this reconstruction program. But three years on and I can see it, see it clearly. The initial stages were a mess. YES. There was no planning what so ever, they had money sitting out there and were “ordered” to “obligate” every penny in the shortest time ever or else it would expire and they wont be able to use it. Hence the chaotic manner of how contracts were awarded.
Right now, not many people can visualize whats really going on here in Iraq. But I can. I have come a long way to realize the reality of it all. Unfortunately though, there are people who prey on bad news. Sorry, no bad news in this post. What you read here, is factual. I have no agenda to benefit from the words Im writing. Reality is, things have been built. Projects have been renovated and fixed. For me, its like a massive canvass of mosaic pieces scattered all over. You cant see the complete piece of art just yet. But its there. It really is. I KNOW.
People have become skeptical, and rightly so. But the question of “What have you done for the Iraqi people today?” should be hung in every Iraqi Ministry and organization instead. I wonder what THEIR answer will be? Because honestly, THEY have done NOTHING, NOTHING for their people, except embezzle money. Yup. That’s the truth. The Iraqis, or to be specific, the Iraqis in the government and higher places, are the laziest most unreliable people ever. They have no interest in benefitting their country nor their people. They are first class crooks!!! And seriously, none of them deserve to be here!
I will give you an example, a very simple one without breaching any confidentiality. Take Project A. Within the scope of work of that project, is to give training to the Iraqi engineers inorder for them to learn techniques on how to handle maintaining the state of the art systems installed. It’s the Ministry’s call to choose who to send to these training sessions, which initially were held in England, Italy, Jordan, Egypt etc. Key word here is “Maintenance”. You don’t send the general manager, or a secretary or the vice president!?! You send engineers that will have hands on experience, people who actually will do the dirty work and who need to know the nitty gritty.
Ministry comes back with a huge list of names. Ofcourse none are the hands on people. They took it as a tourism trip. Many wouldn’t even attend the sessions, instead they would go out and have fun. Ok, granted, they are in need of some freedom, some air to breathe. BUT, this is a project worth millions of dollars. Anyhow, they come back from training with ofcourse no lessons learnt. The Americans have completed the project, and left. Job is done. Finished.
A week, literally a week after it was handed over to the Iraqis, the project was in tatters! Parts of it burnt, and others unfixable. A project worth millions of dollars gone down the drains!!! Down the drains JUST LIKE THAT!!! No, Its not the Americans fault. They have completed the job. It’s the Iraqis fault for not wanting to learn. For not wanting to take care of these essential projects. So seriously “What have YOU done for the Iraqis Today?”
People are scared that the US will leave. Those are the same people that were fighting the US. The same people who killed and butchered them. The same people who swore a Jihad War against them. Now they want them to stay? Wow, truly we are people of contradictions. In my own “humble” opinion, I think its time for the US to leave. I used to think they should stay to correct the mayhem and chaos they have started, but no. There is no point anymore. Its now the Iraqis turn to stand on their feet.
Yes, there will be bloodshed, no doubt. But this cant go on forever. Iraqis have become weak. Weak and far too dependant on others. They have become ungrateful, greedy, evil people. And here again, I mean the ones in government and higher up. Very few care. Very few. If the coalition forces keep supporting them via money, project rebuilding, security etc, Iraqis will never be able to stand on their feet. NEVER. And inorder to survive they HAVE TO LEARN!!!
Remember, for the past 35 years or more, this country was ruled by one and only one ruthless leader. All these in power now, never ever dreamt that the day will come where THEY will have a say and the power. Its just like picking someone off the streets and giving him a million dollars. Something he never tasted before. If the person is good natured, then he will do good things. If he has an evil streak then wave goodbye…And I think I have waved many goodbyes regarding this Iraqi government. Theyre USELESS!
I also learnt that we are such a whining bunch of people. Ughhhh. I know I mustn’t generalize, but being here all this time, made me get off my high horse. FINALLY. Iraqis are not saints nor are the foreign troops. But we blame the US for Haditha, we blame the US for Abu Ghraib, we blame the US for every friggin damn thing, when in reality, we miss the whole point of looking within ourselves. Did we forget the hundreds of tortured prisoners in the Interior ministry??? Did we forget those innocent orphans that were starved to death by their own Iraqi caretakers??? Wow! Did we forget the raping, killing, kidnapping, torture of women and children by OUR OWN PEOPLE??? If we Iraqis, cannot respect our own blood, why do we expect strangers, to respect us!!!
Yeah we tend to have a very short term memory. We always turn the tables around and play the blame game. ENOUGH. Five years on and we cant get along. Five years on, and we cant even stand on our own feet. Even a five year old kid has more will than this 26 million nation!!! WAKE UP. WAKE and ask yourself. Ask yourself what have you done for the Iraqis today? Stop being a bunch of hypocrites and narcissists. No wonder Iraqis are doomed everywhere. This is the truth. The blatant Neurotic Iraqi Truth…
Come today and I myself can answer that question. They have done A LOT. I have been a long time critic of the US and this reconstruction program. But three years on and I can see it, see it clearly. The initial stages were a mess. YES. There was no planning what so ever, they had money sitting out there and were “ordered” to “obligate” every penny in the shortest time ever or else it would expire and they wont be able to use it. Hence the chaotic manner of how contracts were awarded.
Right now, not many people can visualize whats really going on here in Iraq. But I can. I have come a long way to realize the reality of it all. Unfortunately though, there are people who prey on bad news. Sorry, no bad news in this post. What you read here, is factual. I have no agenda to benefit from the words Im writing. Reality is, things have been built. Projects have been renovated and fixed. For me, its like a massive canvass of mosaic pieces scattered all over. You cant see the complete piece of art just yet. But its there. It really is. I KNOW.
People have become skeptical, and rightly so. But the question of “What have you done for the Iraqi people today?” should be hung in every Iraqi Ministry and organization instead. I wonder what THEIR answer will be? Because honestly, THEY have done NOTHING, NOTHING for their people, except embezzle money. Yup. That’s the truth. The Iraqis, or to be specific, the Iraqis in the government and higher places, are the laziest most unreliable people ever. They have no interest in benefitting their country nor their people. They are first class crooks!!! And seriously, none of them deserve to be here!
I will give you an example, a very simple one without breaching any confidentiality. Take Project A. Within the scope of work of that project, is to give training to the Iraqi engineers inorder for them to learn techniques on how to handle maintaining the state of the art systems installed. It’s the Ministry’s call to choose who to send to these training sessions, which initially were held in England, Italy, Jordan, Egypt etc. Key word here is “Maintenance”. You don’t send the general manager, or a secretary or the vice president!?! You send engineers that will have hands on experience, people who actually will do the dirty work and who need to know the nitty gritty.
Ministry comes back with a huge list of names. Ofcourse none are the hands on people. They took it as a tourism trip. Many wouldn’t even attend the sessions, instead they would go out and have fun. Ok, granted, they are in need of some freedom, some air to breathe. BUT, this is a project worth millions of dollars. Anyhow, they come back from training with ofcourse no lessons learnt. The Americans have completed the project, and left. Job is done. Finished.
A week, literally a week after it was handed over to the Iraqis, the project was in tatters! Parts of it burnt, and others unfixable. A project worth millions of dollars gone down the drains!!! Down the drains JUST LIKE THAT!!! No, Its not the Americans fault. They have completed the job. It’s the Iraqis fault for not wanting to learn. For not wanting to take care of these essential projects. So seriously “What have YOU done for the Iraqis Today?”
People are scared that the US will leave. Those are the same people that were fighting the US. The same people who killed and butchered them. The same people who swore a Jihad War against them. Now they want them to stay? Wow, truly we are people of contradictions. In my own “humble” opinion, I think its time for the US to leave. I used to think they should stay to correct the mayhem and chaos they have started, but no. There is no point anymore. Its now the Iraqis turn to stand on their feet.
Yes, there will be bloodshed, no doubt. But this cant go on forever. Iraqis have become weak. Weak and far too dependant on others. They have become ungrateful, greedy, evil people. And here again, I mean the ones in government and higher up. Very few care. Very few. If the coalition forces keep supporting them via money, project rebuilding, security etc, Iraqis will never be able to stand on their feet. NEVER. And inorder to survive they HAVE TO LEARN!!!
Remember, for the past 35 years or more, this country was ruled by one and only one ruthless leader. All these in power now, never ever dreamt that the day will come where THEY will have a say and the power. Its just like picking someone off the streets and giving him a million dollars. Something he never tasted before. If the person is good natured, then he will do good things. If he has an evil streak then wave goodbye…And I think I have waved many goodbyes regarding this Iraqi government. Theyre USELESS!
I also learnt that we are such a whining bunch of people. Ughhhh. I know I mustn’t generalize, but being here all this time, made me get off my high horse. FINALLY. Iraqis are not saints nor are the foreign troops. But we blame the US for Haditha, we blame the US for Abu Ghraib, we blame the US for every friggin damn thing, when in reality, we miss the whole point of looking within ourselves. Did we forget the hundreds of tortured prisoners in the Interior ministry??? Did we forget those innocent orphans that were starved to death by their own Iraqi caretakers??? Wow! Did we forget the raping, killing, kidnapping, torture of women and children by OUR OWN PEOPLE??? If we Iraqis, cannot respect our own blood, why do we expect strangers, to respect us!!!
Yeah we tend to have a very short term memory. We always turn the tables around and play the blame game. ENOUGH. Five years on and we cant get along. Five years on, and we cant even stand on our own feet. Even a five year old kid has more will than this 26 million nation!!! WAKE UP. WAKE and ask yourself. Ask yourself what have you done for the Iraqis today? Stop being a bunch of hypocrites and narcissists. No wonder Iraqis are doomed everywhere. This is the truth. The blatant Neurotic Iraqi Truth…
37 Comments:
Should people get credit for reconstructing what they destroyed, that is assuming they reconstructed anything.
Should the Germans get credit for compensating the jews ? Should the jews thank them ?
hi neurotica. you are certainly being too harsh on the iraqi people. based in what i've read in other blogs, they made a terrific job reconstructing iraq after the gulf war. and think about what you've said. iraqis go for training and come back knowing nothing. well, weren't these people tested? certainly not. then the training schools are handling certificates without ensuring that the lessons were learned. the project got burned and rotten? why didn't the agency follow closely if things were being done right? don't they have a senior consultant to watch how things progress? that is what serious agencies do. so i can't agree that americans complete their job and things rot only when iraqis take over.
tib,
iraqis go for training and come back knowing nothing. well, weren't these people tested? certainly not. then the training schools are handling certificates without ensuring that the lessons were learned.
I disagree. I've seen the same thing with Saudis back in the 1980s when I was in the US Marines. The Saudi military officers that were being sent to the US to learn how to operate American military equipment properly, weren't even attending the classes. And the Saudis sent high ranking military officers for training, when they should have sent the enlisted personnel or junior officers who are the ones who actually need to know how to operate things like American tanks, artillery pieces, planes and helicopters.
But they didn't. They sent senior officers with connections to the royal family who treated their time in the US that was supposed to be for military training as if it was paid vacation. Want to know why the Saudi military sucks ass? That is why, right there. They spend billions on the best equipment money can buy, and they can't even be bothered to learn how to use it properly.
And what do you propose the solution is, when x number of training slots are made available, and a country sends x number of obviously inappropriate and disinterested trainees? Whose fault is that? Whose job is it to fix a problem like that?
This answers a lot of my lack of understanding as to why more progress hasn't been accomplished.
I visit many Iraqi blogspots and have never read this explanation before.
Thank you for your honesty.
Good luck to you and Hubby.
Ever think of running for office? :)
One of the major arguements between Obama and McCain is the success of the surge. Obama will not admit it worked, while McCain thinks it did. What do you think? Here, the media gives us the statistics on the success or lack thereof regarding the surge. We all know how unreliable that is.
Always,
Melanie
programmer craig: "And what do you propose the solution is, when x number of training slots are made available, and a country sends x number of obviously inappropriate and disinterested trainees? Whose fault is that? Whose job is it to fix a problem like that?"
the iraqi scenario is different of the saudi because in iraq americans have much more control over how things are done. as neurotica pointed: "A week, literally a week after it was handed over to the Iraqis, the project was in tatters!" so why are american handing such things to unqualified personnel, iraqis or not? can't they wait until the iraqi government decides to train proper people? so for me it is far from clear whose fault that is.
tib, I assume reconstruction projects are all done by contract, including any training required prior to signing off on it as "complete". If the terms of the contract have been (technically) fulfilled, on what basis would one of the parties not live up to their obligations? I agree with you in spirit, but the law is a different matter :)
@craig: you may be right, but i dont think that the usual client/contractor pattern applies here. first because most projects are financed and executed by US, so americans can impose whatever conditions they want. second because the US army is totally involved in the process and american soldiers are dying to support it, so the army certainly has power to influence how things are handled. that is why i think americans could do more to solve the problems pointed by neurotica.
You want a learning war?
I am prepared to propose this concept of "Learning Slave" to my superiors.
Yes I follow you but somehow we are going to have to teach these parakeets to fly?
Would Pontius Pilate be a better choice for this role?
Not likely.
In all truth expectations for "Trading Commodities" were not that of learning. What if they fly those big American all the way over to Iraq just to say they are sorry? When Religion was the only game in town the Atheists were the slaves. Now the only people in America that kinda fit the Atheist description are children. That's the thing. Children are America's greatest resource. I'll be damned what they could be doing with those children. Army up a horde of Moses' get some foot traffic? Every time you have second thoughts about leaving a job? Who are you fucking Moses? Then I'm the tears on your babies cheeks. Isn't it unfortunate when they can taste the difference between Pepsi and Coke? Americans are all Milk Today gone Tomorrow? We use your people as an excuse to lick up blood. Jihad's an excuse for "No god damn milk!?!". The "Trading Commoditities" clear out when they can't give a fuck about Pepsi or Coke, Blood or Milk. Theirs your Israelites Mrs. Moses. Free as a bird now. The Class in the Church with the Gun.
Ok, let me try to explain in more details. Tib, unfortutantely Im not being harsh, Im being realistic. I state facts, facts that I have seen in my own eyes. Why do you think Im frustrated????Do you think its easy for me to condemn Iraqis?Im one of them for Gods sakes. But anyhow, let me explain how things work so you all can have a better picture.
Right at the beginning, around 03, contracts were given to huge US corporations, as we all know, like KBR, Parsons, etc. These all failed, simply because they couldnt complete the projects in the time they promised and asked for millions of dollars more than what the contract was signed. These were all cost plus contracts.
Come in 05, the decision was made that all these contracts should be terminated and instead they were given to Iraqi construction companies. Contracts were Firm Fixed price. SO no matter what happens there wont be any cost over runs. Iraq companies did a great job, Im not even going to contradict that. Majority of them did, others didnt. But in the end, they actually built things. So Im not arguing there.
The ministries, or the Iraqi counterparts that at the end of the day will accpet these projects are called the "client". Ok, every huge project that was done, included a maintenance, operations and sustainablity training courses. These are for the benefit of the Iraqis inorder for them to know and learn how to operate these systems.
When the ministries were asked for names of trainees, as I mentioned they gave a huge list of people that have nothing to do with the hands on. Its not the contractor's or the US's say, whether these people can go or not. No one says NO to the Ministry.
Ok, that said, training sessions took place with some people not showing up, again its not the trainers job to force people to attend. The trainers are doing their job within the scope of work, its the people that werent interested. Training was done for some people. Project was complete, and handed over to the Ministry. The contractor's contract is done and closed out. Its finished, theyre going home. The majority of the OMS contracts are done by US contractors, where the construction of these projects are done by the Iraqi subs.
When project was complete, within one week, Iraqis werent able to operate it, due to the lack of knowledge. remember now, the people that were sent werent the hands on people. So basically the technicians, had a glitch, tried to fix the old fashioned way, and there you end up with a burnt part, and another thats unfixable.
Now, whose fault is that? The contractors? NOOOOOOOO. Its the darn Ministry for being so unreliable. Oh and the funniest part was I was told one entity actually refused sending anyone because "they didnt want to be influenced by the West"?!? WTH
See where my frustrations come from Tib? Billions of dollars were spent on projects, some really are state of the art with the most upto date equipment!Yet, it all goes down the drains.
Another example, medical equipment. Amazing, top of the range machines. These were handed to the MoH, and you know where they ended up???IN the firggin black market!!! Not in hospitals or clinics. People ask where the hell did the money go, why are the hospitals in such bad condtions. Look at the americans they have done jack. WRONG. The reconstruction companies did everything they can. But can they stop ministry of health who by the way is Al Sadr followers to stop selling the machines in the black market and instead use them to benefit their own people??? NOOOOOO.
The US's job is done. Now its time for Iraqis to stand up and face the music.
So am I being harsh Tib, when I see the Iraqis squandering every good thing? Am I being harsh, because I know the truth? Come here, come over and see the mayhem. Then and only then, maybe you will understand me.
First anon, I never said that. Dont put words in my mouth...Read my words properly then comment on them.
PG I think you know what Im talking about right? You seem to understand.
Lol Melanie, NO WAY. Running for office? omg...Answer to your question, at first surge didnt work, right now it did. But at the same time there are many other factors that are making Baghdad abit more livable. The mahdi militia truce. The awakening that started fighting al qaeda. So its not just the surge, its all these factrs.
Wayne, Im just stating facts. Maybe others are far too blinded by their whining and the blame game. Im just sick and tired of ignorant people. I really am.
hello neurotica, thanks for your detailed explanation. i totally understand your point about the iraqis you mentioned and wasn't my intention to ignore their responsibility in those problems, but there is something that i just can't understand: why can't americans say NO to the Ministry and change the situation? why can't americans hunt the Al-Sadr men in the MoH or force the iraqi government to expel those thieves? why can't americans make sure that only reliable and honest people have a place in the iraqi government so that the rest of iraqis can show their true value? americans went to iraqi to put a decent government in charge, right? so why aren't them doing that? that is what i can't understand.
tib;
you're right, you don't understand. There is such a thing as sovereignty. It's VERY real to Iraqis, and the point of the whole exercise here is to try and turn over the country to a responsible sovereign government. Here's an elected Iraqi government insisting it's responsible and demanding sovereign control.
How far can the US go in saying, "No, you're a bunch of corrupt sectarian buffoons and no damn way are we giving back control."??? That's what you're recommending.
I REALLY wish the abbreviated elective terms of say 3 years had continued a while longer, because it seems Iraqis would be more than ready now to turf the sectarians. And they know it, and are desperately trying to make hay while the sun shines, plus prevent the horrible electoral slaughter they face.
edit_mommies;
That is one of the most incoherent posts I've ever read. I hope there's an antidote for the drugs you're on.
Neurotica;
Why don't you tell us how you REALLY feel? ;)
@brian: that has nothing to do with sovereignty, but with pressuring the government to do the right thing. take north corea for instance. americans said to them "we can help you but you must stop your nuclear program" and they did, that worked, that is how you pressure governments. americans are very good in doing it across the globe, so how come they can't influence or just say no to the iraqi government?
why can't americans say NO to the Ministry and change the situation? why can't americans hunt the Al-Sadr men in the MoH or force the iraqi government to expel those thieves? why can't americans make sure that only reliable and honest people have a place in the iraqi government so that the rest of iraqis can show their true value? americans went to iraqi to put a decent government in charge, right? so why aren't them doing that? that is what i can't understand.
Tib: Instead of asking "why can't the americans" why don't you ask yourself "why can't the iraqis
Tib: North Korea still has a nuclear program
Good post. The Iraqis should also remember (and the non-Iraqi Arabs should learn of) the torture in Abu Ghraib and other Iraqi prisons that took place before 2003.
"Tib: Instead of asking "why can't the americans" why don't you ask yourself "why can't the iraqis"
i know why iraqis can't, neurotica explained that very well.
edit_mommies;
That is one of the most incoherent posts I've ever read. I hope there's an antidote for the drugs you're on. - Brian H.
I'm drug and alcohol free. Making people subordinate doesn't help anyone. Brian these people are ashamed of being left out of the loop. The idea they grow without painful alienation resulting in violence is limiting. You exhibit a bad attitude. I choose to wake up with people of all colors, shapes and sizes. Your prejudice cannot be excused with sobriety. The people at her office must be driving NIW crazy. They are putting her under emotional pressure without a doubt. Weak people will do anything for an emotional display. A good example is your mindless attack on the little help I can manage. I'm sorry Brian. It is not necessary for adults to cry. It is absolute they empower a positive change. Nor should they have to put the words in each others mouths. Naturally the River Delta where Iraq met all these wonderful Nations is intrepid. The same can probably be said for the people tiring there. With any language I grow concern from inside. People reflect upon my presence. If my presence hinders them someone is not pulling their weight. Medicine can be limited with thoroughness and biological control. Drugs would be cultural and if unstructured narcissistic romance. Any questions?
Tib, its exactly what Brian is saying. Let me tell you something, again hopefully it will explain a few things. We (we here is people working here) are told Iraqi govt is the client. You dont tell them what to do. You advise them, assist them if need be.
As brian mentioned, since Iraq is supposedly a sovereign country now, the americans have no right to tell them what to do. That will just complicate things. You dont seem to grasp the complexity of the situation.
Who are you voting for Brian?
IM, exactly. Bes its like putting a broken record on. I am so frustrated with the Iraqi govt right now, its driving me crazy. In the past 2 weeks I have heard and seen things I couldnt imagine. I knew they were a bunch of waste of space, but not to THAT extent. And to be honest, Im glad I iwll be leaving, I dont think I can handle more BS. This govt is greedy, and selfish. Wallah mojo come and see the poeple. see the conditions theyre living in. Its heartbreaking...
i read somewhere, the truth shall set you free. but everyone has their own version of the truth. so theoretically, everyone is free.
i know. i'm being silly. semi-silly. but there is a grain of truth.
sharing ones truth with another is very important. accepting another's truth is the beginning of love.
NEUROTICA LUV,WHEN YOU HAVE A SAMPLE OF STOOGES ,PUPPETS OF AN AXIS OF EVIL RUNNING SO CALLED MINISTRIES !!!!!ARE YOU SURPRISED THAT THERE MAIN OBJECTIVE IS TO STUUF THEIR GOBS &POCKETS & RANSACK THE PLACE HIGH & DRY !!!!IT SIMPLY IS NOT IN THEIR INTERESTS TO BUILD OR IMPROVE THE LOT OF THE NATION AS A WHOLE THEY DO NOT EVEN LIKE OR TOLERATE PARTS OF THE SAME NATION MUCH LESS DO ANYTHING FOR THEIR IMPROVEMENT !!!THEY ARE IN PLACE AT THE BEHEST OF THE AXIS OF EVIL TO THE EAST TO DO THEIR BIDDING &THEIRS IS A DESTRUCTIVE AGENDA OF THE PENNINSULA & IT,S PEOPLES!!!!SO NEUROTICA LUV DO NOT BE SURPRISED BY THE THIEVING EVIL LOT IN HIGHER PLACE OF THE SO CALLED ECHOLONS OF THIEVING DIRECTORY OF IRAQ SAD SAD :(IF AMERICA HITS THAT AXIS OF EVIL & IT,S PUPPETS ONCE & FOR ALL IT SHALL HAVE DONE THE GLOBE A FAVOUR ,ALL THE VERY BEST OF MERRY JOLLY GREETINGS &KINDEST REGARDS DARLING WWW.BFBS.COM CHEERS "OLAFF:)
"We are told Iraqi govt is the client. You dont tell them what to do."
ok, i understand that and i believe you, but let me explain why it is so hard for me to accept this awful scenario. in my mind the iraqi govt cannot be seen as a client, but as a partner, and that is because the american army, which is not a private company, is totally involved in the reconstruction process. american soldiers are dying to support those projects, and they are not employees, they represent the american govt. that means that the two governments are partners, and in a partnership each part have the right to question the actions of the other parts. that is what doesn't make sense to me.
Well I've learned a lot reading here. More than the headlines in western press give me
Thanks everyone for the debate.
aunt jemima, or should I say aunt neurotica.
"Why doesn't America fix this"?
Because the US no longer controls the Iraqi ministries, it can't micromanage Iraqi staff. If the US can't force the Iraqi government fund its own regions, then how can it hope to force well-connected bureaucrats to provide training classes for the right personnel instead of handing them out as free vacations to friends, allies and relatives?
If an Iraqi manager's ineptitude/corruption destroys a $1M project, then his boss is responsible for firing him before he does even more damage or gets someone killed. If his boss does not do so, then the boss is responsible and should be fired. Ultimately, the minister is responsible. If a minister can't handle that without US help, then he's the wrong man for the job. If a ministry is completely overrun with corruption, then the minister should be sacked and the ministry shaken up from top to bottom. Could the US Marines do this? No, of course not.
Let's also remember that most Iraqis - and most Americans - want the US to leave Iraq in the near future. If the US military were to forcibly replace half of Iraq's bureaucrats, would Iraqis or Americans be pleased? Or would the US be criticized for "destabilizing Iraq just when things were getting better" (too bad we can't turn conspiracy theories into fuel for cars!) and the US would be rightly criticized for its heavy-handed interference just when it claims to be trying to withdraw troops.
Neurotica is right. And this situation won't change until a critical mass of officials believe that their job is to serve the Iraqi people instead of ruling them, or living well at their expense.
- Another Random Lurker
Neurotica, thanks for the post and follow ups. We, Iraqis, should stand up for our country and so far we have done nothing to help that.
Please do take the time to share with us more of these details. Whilst all Iraqis know about the corruption of the governing parties, details always help people visualize the scale of the disaster. The governing parties are treating Iraq’s assets as if it is a private property whilst millions of ordinary Iraqis live unbearable conditions in Iraq and outside. Unfortunately, if Iraqis do not stand up for their rights and insist on keeping their heads stuck in the sands of organized religion, then their future won’t be better than their present.
No tib, thats just it. Its NOT a partnership. In some cases, yes, in others NO. Besides, imagine this, I come into your house, and try to paint your wall. You tell me, you want green, and I look around, I see that green wont really work with what you have. I tell you but tib, it wont suit your furniture, why dont you go for the off white? You will say NO I WANT GREEN. I cant force you, I will advise you, I will explain to you reasons, but cant paint your house a colour you dont want even if I know it wont look nice. Get the point?
Anon, I think more posts like this will be coming soon...
ARL, yes, thats exactly it. But when will this happen? With the quality of people ruling this place, things will never change. And these people are in it for the long haul!!!
Hey Leo, how r u?yes, we havent done anything for the Iraqis you are right. I tried, all I can do is help a handful, but what about the rest of the 26million? It sure is one messy place. Im gonna post more things so you know the kind of people that are ruling this place.
hi neurotica, your analogy is clear but i still do not agree because if you paint my house you are doing something for me, not for you or for us. and if the color is ugly, that wont harm you or your loved ones. the iraq reconstruction is different. americans are doing that because that is vital for their own security against terrorists. that is why they are dying and investing big money to deliver the projects. and that is why i can't understand how they let the iraqi govt destroy something that is so vital for them. i understand the type of relationship that they have, you explained that very well, i just don't understand how something like that can happen, something is really wrong with the americans too, not only with iraqis.
Could you please explain why you are in the Green Zone, besides being the wife of Hubby who is there? In fact can you tell us if Hubby works for the "government" or for a private company? There are oh so many questions to pose to you to make sense of what is going on in the country and of what you are blogging. I hope you can enlighten us all please.
neurotica, let me add something, perhaps my point will be more clear. i'm not questioning or observations or how you see the situation. i think you are right about iraqis but i think that you should be critical also about americans, let me explain why. take the lybia case. after great pressure that government went from terror supporter to terror victims aider. good job, and there are lots of similar examples. so why cant americans pressure the iraqi govt too? that would make the iraqis better and in the end everybody would get benefits. that is the mystery for me.
global: all that information is in her olders posts.
tib -
It's easy to put pressure on a dictator like Qaddafi over a very narrow, clearly defined policy matter such as settling a lawsuit or abandoning a WMD program.
But you are suggesting that Americans coercively micromanage the day-to-day activities of mid-level officials in Iraq's Ministries of Health, Energy, etc.
At a time when the US is trying to turn even *security* control over to local forces (be they Awakening Councils or the Iraqi army), and at a time when even Bush is talking about timetables for withdrawal from Iraq, this approach would "turn the clock back" and tighten the American grip on the country. Very few people - in Iraq or in the USA - want that to happen.
It's quite valid to criticize Bush for invading Iraq in the first place, and it's completely reasonable to criticize his administration for its profoundly inept management of the country during the subsequent years. But at this point, to blame the US for NOT ousting Iraq's democratically elected government, its ministers or their staffs seems unfair. A lot of Iraqis would be rightfully furious if the US did what you propose.
Finally, as Neurotica implied, a muscle that is never exercised becomes weak and useless. Iraq desperately needs to seize this opportunity - while it still has some external support - to exercise its very weak muscles of "good governance" and accountability to the Iraqi people. It can't rely on Americans to make sure that officials send the right people to a training class.
Some parts of Iraqi society are working hard to rebuild (especially at local levels). But the bureaucracy of the central government is a disaster that can only be fixed by Iraqis themselves.
Ramadan mubarak to those of you who are fasting, and my thanks for an informative post and discussion.
- Another Random Lurker
Tib:
No matter how anyone tries to explain it to you, you are not going to get it because you are set on making this the Americans problems instead looking at the big picture, the Iraqi government needs to take control of the country they are supposed to be leading, which NIW has given you several explanations on why the Iraqi Government needs to step up to the plate (so to speak). What happens when all of the American troops are gone? Do you still them want them to send representatives to tell the Iraqi Government how to run their country.
lurker: "A lot of Iraqis would be rightfully furious if the US did what you propose."
i propose pressure and monitoring, not ousting. democratic regimes need that to do a good job. why bush was so careful about hurricane gustav, and even missed the convention? because of the pressure he received after katrina. wasn't the powerful fema guy fired after katrina? that is pressure. apparently nobody is pressuring the iraqi government so they can sell an entire hospital in the black market and that is fine. yes, iraqis need to seize this opportunity, but for that they need some way to pressure their government, and in my opinion that is where americans could help more. sure, they cant micromanage all the work but certainly they can influence who is hired for some the key positions, and that would make all the difference.
Hello Neurotica,
Excellent posting. I enjoy reading your posting alot, as they are all true about the reality that Iraq is facing.
As for those who still say the US are to blame, I will not want to enter any argument on this topic, as I know where it will lead, but I do have one thing to say:
Before we put the blame on the US or others, Iraqies should fix the bad Iraqies first who give dam about thier country. There is a saying:
If your in your house and found that there is a thief inside and outside your house, who should you fight first? ...... The one inside
first.
This is why we should blame and tackel those Iraqies first that care nothing for the good ones
and not for every problem blame the US.
I am not a fan of the US and never been one, but we should also not hide the reality.
Regards
Tib_
The pressure put on Bush after Hurricane Katrina was by the American people, so the Iraqi people need to take a stand and put the pressure on the Iraqi government. Look at it like this; If you were a president of a company or corporation and that company had a sister corporation and the President of the sister corporation tries to come in and tell you how to run your company, i'm sure you would not take that lightly and you would tell that other presiednt that you will run your company as you see fit. How are the Iraqi people supposed to respect and support their government when they do not take responsibility, instead they just point fingers at the American Government.
Tib think of it this way, if the US forced the Iraqi gov. to act on these people in the ministries it would be seen, even though the intention is quite different, as just following orders from America meaning the gov. is nothing but a puppet of the americans even if there intentions are well meaning.
Plus any move made against Al Sadr and his followers especially those in power in the gov. would broadcast that they are innocent and that these actions re further proof of americans not respecting iraqi soverignty and that the iraqi gov. only serves US interests and not those of the people. Guess who the world would believe? Considering how big of a credibility problem the US has it would most likely be Al Sadr. You also have to remember Al Sadr has a powerful militia who can cause a lot of trouble in a very little amount of time.
As for your example of Libya, that took decades.
Here is something to think about. In afghanistan your having a meeting with tribal leaders and they are all shouting and arguing you come in and tell them to please be quiet and only speak one at a time. Your intention is well meaning but in reality in afghanistan culture, telling the tribal heads to speak one at a time so everyone can talk and be heard respectfully is dishonoring to them.
Post a Comment
<< Home